(Disclaimer: This transcript is auto-generated and may contain mistakes.)

How's it going everyone? Welcome to this edition of the Sword of the Spirit podcast. This is Ben Naim here with a very special guest on this week's episode of the program. I'm looking forward to what should be an interesting discussion and without wasting any time, let me introduce him to you. Brian Fisher from American Family Radio was joining me via telephone tonight. Brian I want to say first of all, thanks for coming on the show as a special guest, I look forward to picking your brain a little bit on a number of issues here. It's good to have you on. Well thank you for having me on Ben, I appreciate it very much. Well I've titled this podcast In Defense of the Family and I felt like if I was going to do something that was themed this way, that you would be a good candidate to bring on and talk about this because this is something that you've covered extensively over the years. You have been unapologetic in your passionate defense of the nuclear family unit and I'll ask you some questions related to that in a few moments but before we get to it, for those who are perhaps unfamiliar with your daily radio show, right off the bat I wanted to make sure we plugged it. You do have a live stream on YouTube but also a daily radio show courtesy of American Family Radio which airs weekdays starting at 1pm central. You can correct me if I'm wrong on any of that but did you want to just talk a little about your program to start things off here so if there are people out there who are interested they can go check it out. Sure they can go to our website, afr.net, afr.net, we've got a station finder there so they can look and see if there is one of our stations in the area where they live. If they don't they can listen to the program live by going to that website, afr, that's for American Family Radio, afr.net and they can pick up a live audio stream right there and as you mentioned we also have a live video and audio stream on our Focal Point Facebook page. The name of the program is Focal Point, they can live stream it on our Focal Point Facebook page. We also have a YouTube channel, the Focal Point YouTube channel, different ways there that they can catch the program live and also if people are inclined to do the podcast thing we've got a podcast that's available also at afr.net, same place, they never need to miss a program. Obviously with coronavirus craziness going on right now it seems like a lot of people have been affected in many different ways. I know friends and family who've just tried their best to maintain their normal lives. Just to start things off here, how much of an impact has this been for you in terms of things changing with all this craziness? Well I'm fortunate in my situation because I used to, I lived in Mississippi where our headquarters are located until just about a year ago. We just moved out here to the Pacific Northwest almost exactly a year ago to be a little bit closer to family. We've got a son and daughter-in-law that live out here and so I was used to going into our studio and doing the program from our studio there in Mississippi. Since we moved out here they were kind enough to set me up with a little home studio so that's what I'm talking to you from right now and really for me things really haven't changed at all in terms of schedule because it's about a 15-foot commute for me to work now from day one to walk down the hallway and there I am. Things have not really changed much for us in terms of day-to-day stuff. It's obvious they had an impact on our ability to get involved in our church so we have a governor that's real tight about that stuff and he's pretty much shut the churches down everywhere across the state. He will not allow in all of his wisdom will not allow a meeting, a gathering of more than 10 people and so church services he's made them against his particular policy. Governors do not have the authority to do what they're doing because this is true here in the state where I live but the state law and constitution usually provides the governor with a certain amount of emergency powers in a situation like this. He's got a certain amount of authority to take decisions and establish policies to get through a crisis to get through an emergency but quite typically that authority is good for 30 days so it's designed for an emergency, it's designed for a short-term thing. You can't always get your legislature back together so you need to give the governor authority he would not have under normal course of business to make decisions to navigate this crisis but in most cases that authority is only good for 30 days and then if the state wants to extend it, if they want to extend the governor's emergency authority beyond that 30 days they have to convene and reauthorize his emergency authority. Otherwise it expires after 30 days and he has no legal authority just on his own to grant himself an additional 30 days or 60 days or we're going on six months now of emergency authority so I believe that most of these emergency orders are only good for 30 days at the top end. You know, Bill Barr says there's not even an exception for 30 days according to the constitution so anyway we'll see how that shakes out but it's kind of a classic, classic Caesar versus Christ situation the church finds itself in. Yeah, it's definitely not a fun situation in the sense that there's just so much going on right now when you compound the government response to the coronavirus hysteria which in a lot of ways has been a gross overstep and then in addition to that you look at the civil unrest going on in this country courtesy of the fallout from the George Floyd incident which I'll ask you about in a little bit. There's just so much, so much going on in terms of current events and a lot of it doesn't look very good but one thing you've tried to do is be part of the righteous remnant in terms of the fight against degeneracy in this country and you've talked about in years past the horrors of, you know, the quote LGBT community or the sodomite community, some of the predatorial behavior that they often display, how they spread disease, things like that. You've taken a strong stand also against Islam and you've said a number of things that the world would deem to be quote-unquote controversial and it's earned you actually a spot on the Southern Poverty Law Center list evidently which if I were in your position would take that as a badge of honor because that's just a joke organization but could you speak to that a little bit having been recognized by the SPLC for the work you've done, how does it feel to be in that position? Well, yeah, I've got a regular fan club over there but like you say, Ben, it's a bit of an honor to me that I've stood up for what I believe in. They've criticized me. They really can't hurt me. They can make me look bad and I think that's what they're counting on. I'll be embarrassed to be called an Islamophobe. I'll be embarrassed to be called a homophobe by them and I will, you know, kind of shrink away with my tail tucked between my legs and that's what they count on and they've got the media in their corner. They're a thoroughly discredited institution. I mean, they had a sexual misconduct scandal, toxic work environment just swept through their place. They had to fire their director, their leader and others on the staff still complaining about how toxic and unhealthy the work environment is there. For an organization that started fighting civil rights, I mean, they are about as monolithically white as you can get. Very little diversity there. So anyway, they've got problems of their own and it's a sad thing. It's kind of a sad commentary that anybody in the media still takes them seriously because they have no real credibility. They come up with these exaggerated numbers about how many white supremacist groups there are, by the way. They even had some right radiant Tupelo where they used to live in Mississippi and it was nothing more than a post office box. You know, so you wonder and there was nothing there. There was nothing behind it. There were no people, there was no organization, but it still looks pretty good on a map. You see all of these hate groups spread out all over everywhere. So they've, you know, they made a little bit of a name for themselves. You know, we'll still have people that will try to donate to organizations and these organizations will use the SPLC as their guide about whether this is an organization you ought to give to or not. And of course they've dinged us just because we believe that marriage is a union of one man and one woman and that we believe that Islam is a particularly dangerous ideology. You know, for myself, I do not believe that Islam has any fundamental constitutional civil rights because if you look at the history, for instance, of the first amendment, it's very clear what the founders were seeking to do in the first amendment was to protect the free exercise of the Christian faith. In fact, Joseph Story, one of the leading historians, he wrote the first definitive commentary on the constitution, the history of the constitution. And he said, this is a quote, this is kind of from memory and I might garble a word or two, but it pretty much right on it. You know, Joseph Story, who was on the Supreme court, he was the longest serving associate justice on the Supreme court in the 19th century. He was appointed by James Madison, who was the father of the constitution. So of James Madison, the father of the constitution picked him to sit on Supreme court. You can assume that, uh, that Joseph story knew what he was talking about. And he said, when the founders were crafting the first amendment, they were not seeking to advance or even countenance, uh, Hinduism. Well, I think he listed Islam and Judaism and, and, uh, and infidelity atheism. Uh, they weren't even, they weren't even considering those. They weren't trying to promote them and they weren't even considering, you know, to countenance means to face, to deal with. They weren't even deal with those things. Their whole point was to protect the free exercise of the Christian faith and not allow that to be interfered with by the federal government at all. So I don't believe from a constitutional standpoint that Islam has any person amendment rights to the free exercise of religion. You know, it's a totalitarian ideology and the, ours, our law from 1952 when we were dealing with communism, our law prohibits anybody who believes in a totalitarian ideology from even immigrating into the United States. So they can be prohibited even from immigrating to the United States because theirs is a totalitarian ideology. So I forget where we started on this deal. Well, it's okay. It's okay. You know what? Sometimes discussions just sort of organically shift from one topic to the other. But to your point, you look at what happened with Europe and the rape epidemic that was sparked from the influx of Islamic populations coming in, Syrian quote unquote refugees coming in and wreaking havoc. For those out there who might be offended by what you just said, I think you look at real world and real world evidence is what I should say. And it does substantiate what you've been talking about in the sense that this isn't just any other false religion. This is a violent death cult in many ways. And I think we're seeing the consequence of the open border policies in Europe play out even today, even though it's been years now. Well, I've had this terrible thing in England with these rape gangs, and these are gangs of young Muslim males, and they will abuse, sexually abuse young English white girls. That's who they target. Horrifying. And England has turned, what's that? I just said horrifying. Oh, yeah, it is. And I mean, these are teenagers, these are young girls, because that's okay in Islam. You know, Muhammad started having sex with girls when they were nine years old. He married a girl at six and started engaging in intercourse with her at age nine, you know, and Muslims treat Muhammad the same way we look at Christ as the ultimate example, the paradigm, the one whom we should imitate. So they feel if Muhammad did it, then it's okay for any Muslim all the way down through history to imitate his example, and that includes sex with with young girls. So it's a terrible thing. I mean, in Birmingham, England, there were probably 1400 girls that were sexually abused by these Muslim gangs, and the authorities would not do anything about it, because they did not want to run the risk of being tagged as Islamophobic. So, you know, and Islam has been the same since the beginning. I mean, the Islam started out in hostility toward the Christian faith, you know, they rampaged across northern Africa, across Europe, across the Holy Land, and within the first 100 years, they have pretty much conquered all of the Middle East, at the point of the sword, you know, Christianity advances through persuasion, and prayer. But Islam has always always advanced at the point of a sword. So anyway, you know, so to me, if someone's going to ding me for thinking we need to be careful with Islam, like the SPLC has done, called me an Islamophobe, and I don't even call it Islamophobia. I think what it is, is Islamo-realism. You know, we just need to have a realistic view of what Islam believes, we need to look at history. I mean, this religion has been the same for 1400 years, hostile to any expression of Christian faith, and determined to exterminate Christianity from the face of the globe. We just need to have our eyes open to that possibility. Well, we know the Bible says that there's nothing new under the sun, and that applies to different areas of life, for sure. But what we could take from that is, look, there's always been the same problems we're dealing with today. And that also would ring true when it comes to opposition to righteousness. There's always been opposition to righteousness and godly living and traditional values, conservative values. However, to me, it seems like that is amplified in 2020. And I'll give you an example of what I mean by that. Just the idea of, quote, gay marriage would have been unheard of in the United States in time past, very recent history. Even Democrats at one point opposed it. Even Joe Biden and Barack Obama opposed it. My question for you is this, as someone who's been around, OK, you weren't born yesterday. You've seen this transition that has taken place in America, which has gone from sodomy laws to upholding sodomite marriage. How did we get here? Well, you know, it is an amazing thing because America as a culture, as society, has always been firmly opposed to the normalization of homosexual behavior, even in the military. George Washington literally drummed a soldier out of the Continental Army who was apprehended engaging in homosexual sex. And what George Washington did is he called him forward the next day, lined up his drummers in two rows and forced this guy to march out of the Continental Army in front of the entire army with the drums. I mean, literally got drummed out of the army. So that's always been as an example of how we have felt as a nation about homosexuality as something that's fundamentally unnatural. It's unhealthy. It's immoral. It's not what the human body was designed for. You don't have to be a rocket surgeon to figure that out. And we believe in creation. I believe God's behind the design of the human body. And it's clear he did not design the body to be used in that way. You know, and we've always had people I mean, you always had a guy who had a guy in George Washington's day in the military, engaging in homosexual sex with a fellow soldier. So we've always had people in America that have practiced that, have believed in it. You know, even if you read Plymouth Plantation, the history of the Plymouth colony, even they even had to deal in a 1642 with that with a case of bestiality in Plymouth colony, 1642. So this stuff has always been around. What's different is up until I would say probably 40 years ago to the 1960s, maybe the early 1970s, there was a consensus about these great moral values, about these great truths, about the Bible as the word of God and all of that people didn't always honor in the observance, but they believed in it and they would affirm that the Bible is the word of God. Christianity is the truest faith and all of that stuff. And we've always had people that challenge that. We've always had people that are atheists or deists or whatever. You know, Thomas Paine, the common sense, a very influential piece of literature in the Revolutionary War period. He was he was probably an atheist, probably did not believe in God. So we've always had people like that in American history. The difference is for the last 40 to 50 or 60 years, they have been in charge of all of our major institutions. Virtually every educational institution is now in the hands of those who do not believe in Christianity, who believe in a secular worldview, do not believe in the existence of God or do not want to pay him any attention. So that's the difference. So they're controlling so many of these institutions, media is completely under their control. And so they will begin to corrupt the minds of people who depend on them for information or for knowledge or perspective. You know, that's how I just read an article today from a guy that wrote a book called propaganda back in 1928. He said, there's a handful of people that control the way the average American thinks. I mean, he was writing about Europe, but control the way it is a small number of people that determine what an entire population believes because they're in control of the institutions that educate, that dispense perspective on modern life. And so they have a control and they speak with kind of a monolithic voice. Then people feel, well, that's what we're supposed to believe. That's what we're taught to believe. And that's what we're supposed to believe. And it's done a tremendous amount of damage up until, I think, about 1972, I think changed politically. Things changed in 1972 when George McGovern ran for president on the Democratic ticket. And up until then, if you'd asked the Democratic Party about any of these major moral issues, whether it was the definition of marriage, whether it was sex before marriage, whether it was sex outside of marriage, you asked them whether it was homosexuality. You asked them, everybody would have had the same point of view, Democrat and Republican on those great moral issues. There'd be other differences in political philosophy and so forth. But things started to make a radical lurch when he became the Democratic nominee for the presidency and the Democrat Party began to drift rapidly into opposition to a biblical worldview, which has always been what's undergirded American society. And so since then, it's been a trouble, been trouble. And, you know, we are now so far, we are so far apart. There's a chasm now between Republican and Democrat, between liberal. I just call them regressives. People call them, they call themselves progressive. I call them regressive because they want to take us backwards. They want to take us homosexuality. They want to take us back to Sodom and Gomorrah. So there's a there's a chasm right now between the two sides in American culture, between those that believe in Christian values as the underpinning, you know, the Ten Commandments as the guide for all of life. Everybody used to believe in the Ten Commandments that we ought to worship God, that we ought to honor our parents, that we shouldn't have we shouldn't commit adultery. We shouldn't take things that don't belong to us. We shouldn't lie under oath. We shouldn't even covet things that belong. Everybody accepted that. And now on the left, you find people that don't believe any one thing that's in the Ten Commandments. So, you know, like you were mentioning, Ben, we're in a very dangerous place right now as a culture. I don't think people realize just how dangerous our circumstances are right now. We've never had a cultural adversaries that are as filled with hatred and vitriol as they are now. There's no polite disagreement any longer. If you disagree with them, they want to destroy you. You know, they will come and attack your home. They will attack you in the middle of the night. And that's what our leaders are finding out that they're trying to stand up to Antifa or the Black Lives Matter movement. They'll come to their house and threaten them. So it we're in a very, very dangerous place today. I heard in an interview with him, he said, ladies and gentlemen, it's time to get your guns. If you don't have a gun, it's like what Jesus told the disciples. If you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. And I think that's the circumstance we're in now. We've had such a such a contained society, so much peace and stability that a lot of people are just kind of just just wigged out of the thought of owning the gun. But it's past time to be uncomfortable with that. You know, we need to get guns to protect ourselves and our families. I'm not talking about vigilante justice. I'm not talking going out and doing anything other than protecting your own family. If your home and your family comes under a talk, come under attack, we need that. And people need to realize we've got a Second Amendment that gives every man the right to be a protector for himself and for his family. It's time to start exercising our Second Amendment rights or be prepared to do it by selling whatever we need to and buying a gun. Jesus told us to do that. Time to do it. You brought up that chasm between conservative and liberal. To me, I think the modern left is almost symptomatic of the history you touched on a little bit there about our gradual shift as a nation to deviancy. Right. And to the destruction of the nuclear family unit. And what we're seeing go on today, particularly after the George Floyd incident in which Black Lives Matter went insane again. This obviously isn't the first time they've acted up, but Black Lives Matter, along with Antifa, a communist group, they're open about it with their fist in the air symbolism. Of course, Black Lives Matter also open about their Marxist beliefs. But my point is, you have these radical groups, these leftist groups going out. And a lot of these people are just freaks, honestly, going out and they're destroying private property. They're attacking people. And you're right. We do need to arm ourselves to protect ourselves and our families for this. But here's my point. And this is what I wanted to ask you is you look at what's going on with Black Lives Matter brainwashing a lot of these minority communities, a lot of these black communities into believing that, in fact, more degeneracy is the answer. Because you look at their website, it states that one of their mission, one of their goals is to dismantle the nuclear family. When we know that dismantling the nuclear family, in my opinion, you can give me your opinion on this. It's actually the catalyst for the problems, one of the main catalysts for the problems that blacks are going through today in their inner city communities. Can you speak to BLM and the damage that they're doing to minority groups by brainwashing them to accept what is actually exacerbating the problem? Well, you make a good point there, and, you know, I think it's important to distinguish that Black Lives Matter, the organization and the movement and black lives, we all believe if you if you read the word of God, you believe the word of God, you believe that black lives matter because you believe that every life matters. And so I think we need to realize that the movement is a Marxist organization and they are dedicated. I mean, they're very explicit about it. Then you mentioned that they're very explicit about a desire to destroy the nuclear family. And that's because they understand is the main resistance, the main pushback that they're going to get is from the nuclear family. And the nuclear family is God's institution for the foundation of culture. Everything is built around a strong nuclear family, a husband who is committed to his wife together through their intimate love. They bring children into the world and then they raise those children to become responsible adults and to become productive members of society. And so it's designed, that's the cycle that's designed to repeat itself. Well, there are huge problems, you know, even around the turn of the century, there were probably only five percent back on time at the turn of the 19th century, well, turn of the 20th century, I guess what I mean to say there were only about five percent. This is after, you know, this is after slavery. There were only about five percent of black children were raised in single parent homes. And today, seventy two percent of black children are born into homes mostly without a dad in the single parent homes. Well, there's no way the institution of the family can survive. And this is OK with people on the left because they hate the nuclear. They won't say it, but they despise the nuclear family as much as Black Lives Matter, because it's the family that gets in the way of their goals of having all the control, all of society controlled by those in government power. You know, they have their design for what they think society ought to look like. And the only way they can fulfill their vision for society is if they get to tell everybody what to do. And the biggest threat to that is the nuclear family. So it's a huge issue, you know, and I think that, like you point out, the black community has paid a terrible price for the disintegration of the black family. And so that needs to be rebuilt if we're ever going to see any hope for the black community. We need to work with them to rebuild strong marriages. You can't fix the problems in the black community just by giving them more money. We need to give them hope and instruction. We need to help them form lasting marriages. We need black children. You know, a lot of these blacks that are part of the rioting and the violence, there are a lot of whites that are doing this as well. This is not a yes, not restricted to anyone race. You know, I live up here in the Pacific Northwest and most of the violence and the rioting that's taking place up here, like in Seattle and Portland, most of it is being carried out by white rioters. So it's not restricted. It's not limited by race. But you're right that the rebuilding the black family, that is job one. No matter what else we do, if we don't do that, the problem is not going to be fixed. Yeah. And the thing is, it's someone who actually cares about black lives is going to uphold the values you just described there in terms of wanting to rebuild the family. It is the biggest offense we have against their agenda, but also it's people who care about black lives who are speaking out against abortion, who are speaking out against Planned Parenthood. I know you did a live stream and it was entitled. This was recently talking about Margaret Sanger and her being open about her eugenicist beliefs with respect to black people. Talk about that for a minute, because this is something that's toxic to the left. They don't want to touch it with a 10 foot pole. Well, Margaret Sanger believed in what she called eugenics, and that is that there are certain races that are superior to other races. And so what we need to do is make sure that we have more children born to the superior races and get fewer children from the inferior races. And in her world view, the blacks were an inferior race. She referred to them as human weeds and they needed to be eliminated. This is Margaret Sanger. You know, in her views on eugenics, Adolf Hitler picked up those. I mean, she wrote the textbook basically for Adolf Hitler. He followed her blueprint to the letter. That's what leftism looks like when it's stripped of all of its protections, when nobody's fighting back against you get Nazi Germany, because that's what they believe in. Certain races are superior to others. And our job is to get rid of the inferior races and not let them have any more kids. So we only have the kids from the superior race being born. So that was Margaret Sanger believed and she started Planned Parenthood. You know, 79 percent of all the Planned Parenthood clinics are in minority communities. I mean, they locate them there in particular because I mean, just to put it bluntly, if they want to kill black babies and that's what these abortion clinics are places where they dismember black babies before they ever have a chance to be born. You know, and finally, the truth about here is coming out. I don't know if you've read about this, but the abortion clinic that that bore Margaret Sanger's name, kind of their anchor abortion clinic is in New York. She found it like in 1916 or something like that. And it's still going. It's the Margaret Sanger whatever. And they've gotten so embarrassed because the truth about Planned Parenthood and Margaret Sanger has come out, you know, and you had all these organizations apologizing all over them, apologizing all over themselves because their founders had a racist past. They own slaves, whatever. So we've got to pull down their statues. We've got to take their names off of our buildings and all that kind of thing. And they finally got embarrassed enough about the history of Margaret Sanger, who was their patron saint, that they took her name off of the flagship abortion clinic in New York. Now, they're still going right ahead and killing black babies, but they were so embarrassed by the knowledge of her past come to life that they took her name off of it. So, you know, and they're again, they're against the family, obviously. And I read another book on propaganda by a French sociologist by the name of Jacques et al. And the title of the book was propaganda and how propaganda is used to, you know, numb the mind of the masses to deceive them, to mislead them. And basically what he said, the only antidote, this is interesting to me, the only antidote, he said to propaganda is is the small group and the most essential small group in society is a family. That's what insulates people from the influence of propaganda. So small groups like life groups and Bible study groups and fellowship groups where you can study the truth, you can have the truth reinforced. You can be with like minded people who can spot the errors that are being perpetuated and do something about it. So, you know, the family is absolutely critical. It's foundational. You know, and somebody once said that the whole purpose of the left in America is to destroy the first three chapters of the Bible. What they want to do is get rid of the first three chapters of Genesis, because Genesis is where you find the affirmation that there is a creator, that all this just didn't happen by chance. It happened at the hands of a very powerful creator, that man is a creative being. He's not descended from apes and baboons, but he's a direct creation of Almighty God. That's in the first three chapters of Genesis. Then we discover truths about gender, that there are only two of them, male and female. There aren't 58 or 103 or whatever. That's in the first three chapters of Genesis. We discover the truth about the fall of man. The man is not better than he used to be. Man is worse than he used to be. And he has inherently fallen without some kind of redemptive work of God in his life. He's capable of who knows what and marriage. We find that the marriage is the union of one man and one woman. You know, for this reason, a man that's one will leave his mother and father and plead to his wife. That's two. And the two shall become one flesh. That's marriage. One man, one woman. All that's found in the first three chapters of the Bible. And so they, you know, they're incessantly trying to trying to destroy that. You know, in Darwin, you know, Darwin was a racist. He was a racist as much as Margaret Sanger was. A lot of a lot of Margaret Sanger stuff came right out of classic Darwinism. So. Absolutely. And you brought up just those first few chapters of the Book of Genesis and God's redemptive work you have in Genesis three, one of my favorite pictures of that in verse 21, it says unto Adam also and to his wife, did the Lord God make coats of skins and clothed them? I look at that and I see a picture of the righteousness of the Lord Jesus Christ imputed unto those who believed on him. And you're right, there is so much essential information there. And it is unfortunate to be living during times like this in which so many have rejected the truth of God's word and common sense. What you talked about there, two genders, things like that, you know, you just called water wet there. OK, I mean, it's pretty obvious the things you said. But at the same time, instead of lamenting the negative, I look at this as an opportunity for us to promulgate that which is right and really use it, use the opposition as rocket fuel to keep us zealous. You know, obviously you cover current events. I'm not saying that you only cover one topic, but you've gotten a lot of heat for the things you've said about the sodomites, about Islam. And, you know, I think we need more voices out there, especially in the political realm, guys who are covering news, doing radio shows such as yourself. Why is it a rarity, it seems, seemingly, for people to step up? I mean, are they afraid, perhaps, of the backlash? Because I know you've gotten some. Yeah, it's just fear. I mean, you get it right down to what stops people is fear. They know what they believe. They're just afraid to say it. They're afraid to declare it. They're afraid to stand for it because they anticipate so much pushback coming against them. And in some cases, it can be very forceful. Pushback. I mean, they can lose their jobs. They can lose their careers. They've seen it happen to other people. They don't want it to happen to them. So it's just fear is all this. I've lost two jobs because of my stand for the word of God, wouldn't apologize, even though it cost me my job, you know, it cost me a career path that I was on. So we just have to overcome that fear, not give in to stand tall and stand strong for the truth. You know, I was on a radio program once a number of years ago. We were talking about the issue of homosexuality. And of course, he was calling me a homophobe and all that kind of stuff. He was a leftist. And at one point I said something and he said, he said to me, Brian, do you have any idea how much of a bigot you sound? And I said, Tom, you forgot to ask me one question. Do I care that you think I'm a bigot? And the answer is no, I don't care that you think I'm a bigot. So and that's that's just the kind of mentality we have to have. We know the truth. We believe the truth. We are going to proclaim the truth where we have opportunity. We're not going to be obnoxious about it, but we're going to declare the truth. We're not going to back down and trust God to honor our stand. Well, that's just a demoralization tactic to plaster you with the social justice warrior type buzzwords like bigot, racist, homophobe. To my knowledge, you're not afraid of sodomites. OK, I don't think, you know, I don't know who would be. That's what the word means that you're afraid of them. You're not afraid of them. You're just willing to stand for what the Bible so clearly states on this. And like I said earlier, it's just common sense. So I don't think you're a bigot. Well, you know, people call me a, yeah, people call me a homophobe like I'm a, literally what that means is I'm afraid of homosexuals. I'm not afraid of anybody. All right, well, Brian Fisher, I'm going to let you go now. Is there anything else you wanted to say, anything you wanted to plug at all before you, you know, I go ahead and let you get on with the rest of your evening? All right. Well, listen, I appreciate you bringing it up. Speaking of the family, I have a book on fatherhood that's available at our store, American Family Association. AFAstore.net. AFAstore.net is where people can order up a copy. It's called the Boy to Man book. It's a book that I've written for fathers. It's my book on fatherhood, and it's specifically for fathers of 12 year old boys. And it's a short book. They can read it with their 12 year old son. It's designed for a father to read to his 12 year old son. It's just a distillation of the wisdom of Proverbs. I realized one day that what Proverbs is, is Solomon's training manual for fathers, because he's telling us there everything he wanted his son to know on his way to maturity. So I've tried to distill it about 130 pages or so. And I've got a fairly good feedback. I wouldn't have brought it up unless you'd ask, but I would love for people to consider that. You know, they may have a father of a 12 year old son. They might be one and maybe could find this book to be of some help. All right. Brian Fisher, once again, thanks for doing this. I do appreciate your time and I hope you enjoy the rest of your day. Well, thank you, Ben, very much. I appreciate the opportunity to chat with you. It's been an honor. Thank you. God bless. That was Brian Fisher from the American Family Association, American Family Radios, where you could check out his daily live stream. I do one once a week. He's on the air every day, starting at 1 p.m. Central, if you want to listen to his show. Obviously, we don't agree on everything. I did focus on the things that we do agree on. But I'm sure there's plenty of areas that we would disagree. Maybe I'll have them back on and we could talk about them. But you know what, I don't think that this show should be limited only to people who are 100% aligned with me or quote in the movement or whatever. Every once in a while, I do like to reach out to more old IFB type thinkers and sort of get their perspective on the world. I do think that Brian Fisher has done a lot of good work on the nuclear family, defending the nuclear family and has spoken some hardcore truth on the sodomites. All right. Well, that's going to do it for this edition of the Sword of the Spirit podcast. Thanks to everyone in the chat room for tuning in. And for those of you listening later on, on the download, the podcast is available at bendthebaptistkjv.com. That's bendthebaptistkjv.com. It's the best place to go where you can find every single episode of this program that's ever been recorded. You can download it or stream it at bendthebaptistkjv.com. Also, make sure you check this show out on Apple podcasts, the Stitcher radio app and Spotify. Just use the keyword, Bend the Baptist, all one word without spaces and you could subscribe to the show there. But until next time, this is Ben Naim signing off. I will catch you guys again next Monday. As usual, Monday nights, 8 p.m. Central and 9 p.m. Eastern Time is when new episodes of this show air right here. YouTube.com slash Bend the Baptist. Subscribe for more. God bless you all. I will talk to you guys again after a while. Thank you. You