(Disclaimer: This transcript is auto-generated and may contain mistakes.) Alright, we're here in 2 Thessalonians chapter 2 and the name of this sermon is How to Prove a Post-Tribulation Rapture. How to Prove a Post-Tribulation Rapture. And, you know, if you're not familiar with this church, you're going around maybe a short time, our position on the rapture is that it's a post-tribulation slash free rapture. Very dogmatic, this is our position, this is what we believe about the rapture, okay? Now, if you're, if you haven't really studied the end times, you don't necessarily know what you believe on that, I believe this sermon will show you just bottom pretty clear, okay? But the point of the sermon is really that you can learn how to teach other people this doctrine, okay? Because it's one thing to know something, it's another thing to be able to actually teach it to somebody else. Now, let me give you a reason why I'm coming up with a sermon and I'm basically going to preach or teach the exact same thing I did several years ago when I talked to my wife before we were married, because my wife watched After the Tribulation two times, she was still pre-trib, and then I talked to her on the phone and I just explained, you know, this verse, this passage, this passage, I was just out on the walk, didn't have a Bible in front of me, but I was able to tell her where to turn to and she just immediately said, that makes perfect sense, okay? The reason why there's so many different beliefs is people are confused because there's a lot of false things being said, and when they read the book of Revelation, they're like, man, I'm so confused. Look, the Bible's not meant to be confusing. It's meant to be simple, it's meant to be understandable, and when you hear something explained, if it's really complicated, it's probably not true. Now, if it makes sense, then it's going to be like, okay, well, you know the Bible's meant to make sense? I believe that. It makes sense, okay? So when it comes to proving the post-Tribulation rapture, I believe the first place you should turn is 2 Thessalonians 2, not Matthew chapter 24. You say, why? Well, first I would say 2 Thessalonians 2, because it is just as clear as Matthew 24, but also because people have a memorized answer after the Tribulation, and the preacher and crowd has heard that, and they have reasons why they're choosing to reject Matthew 24. We'll look at that later on, but they've already heard that argument, and so then when you say after the Tribulation, it's like, yeah, that's what you say in Matthew 24. What you want to do is hit them where they do not expect you. They expect you to turn to Matthew 24, but 2 Thessalonians 2 is just as clear, and they don't expect that. So you hit them with something they do not expect off of that. Now, let's look at 2 Thessalonians 2. Let's look at verse number 1. Now, we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and by our gathering together onto Him. Now, in the first verse, it's talking about the Lord's coming back, the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together onto Him. The gathering together onto Him, that's referring to the Rapture, and so these two things are being linked together. His coming and also the Rapture, our gathering together onto Him. What the preacher and crowd likes to do is say that there's multiple comings, okay? You don't get that context here from 2 Thessalonians 2, and it's going to contradict itself, but notice how it says the coming and also the gathering. This is talking about when people will be raptured. Notice what it says in verse number 2, that you be not soon shaken in mind or be troubled. So basically, don't be worried, neither by spirit nor by word nor by letter as from us as that the day of Christ is at hand. What is he saying? He's saying it wasn't the Spirit of God, neither by Spirit. It's not the Spirit of God. It's not the Word of God. It says, nor by word nor by letter as from us. It's not an epistle that we wrote to you. So it's not the Spirit of God. It's not the Word of God. It's not a letter from us as that the day of Christ is at hand. What does it mean to be at hand? It means about to take place, and he's saying, look, it wasn't the Spirit of God that told you that He could come in at any moment. It wasn't the Word of God. It wasn't a letter from us as the day of Christ is at hand. You say, well, how do you know it can't come at any moment? Well, notice what it says in verse number 3. Let no man deceive you by any means, for that day shall not come, except there come a fall in the way first, and that man of sin be revealed in the Son of tradition. Look, the Bible says that day is not going to come except first there must be a fall in the way, and the man of sin be revealed in the Son of tradition. Now, look, both of these things must take place, the fall in the way and the man of sin being revealed. Let me ask you a question. Who is the Antichrist? If you don't know who the Antichrist is, which is the man of sin, then he's obviously not revealed himself, because revealing is to make yourself known. And nobody knows who the Antichrist is. And so if the Antichrist is not known, then Jesus cannot come back yet. Why? That man of sin is revealed first. That must take place first. And unless he comes back first, Jesus is not coming back. I hate to break your heart, but Jesus cannot come back before the end of the service. It's not going to happen. The rapture can't just take place out of nowhere. No, the man of sin must be revealed first. That's what the Bible says. Now, in this verse, it says, except there come a fall in the way first. Now, believe it or not, I think 2 Thessalonians 2-3 is a very strong verse that proves it's not a creature of rapture. This is actually one of their biggest arguments. You say, how in the world is 2 Thessalonians 2 verse 3 one of their biggest arguments when it makes it clear that that day is coming, the gathering together, which are one event, that that day is not going to come except there come a fall in the way first and that man of sin be revealed? Now, if you look at the wording of this, both these things must take place, the fall in the way and the man of sin be revealed. But what the preacher and crowd says is this. When it says a fall in the way first, they say that's referring to the rapture. You say, how is a fallen away referring to the rapture? Now, let me say this. When I'm talking about how to prove a posterior rapture, I'm talking about how to prove a posterior rapture to someone who is saved as willing to receive the word of God. But I'm not saying you debate someone, say a person, on the streets. They need to hear the gospel. I'm talking about someone who maybe has heard this teaching and they're confused. But the preacher and crowd says the fall in the way first is the rapture. You say, how do they get that? Because if you look up fall away or fall in the way throughout the Bible, you don't get any context of the reintroduction. What do they do? Well, they go back to the Greek. Isn't that the secret solution when you can't prove it in English? Go back to the Greek. That's what they do. They go back to the Greek and they say, well, in the Greek, falling away means rapture. Basically, the word apostasia can refer to a fall in the way or can refer to a rapture. Isn't it amazing how they just go to another language and say this word can mean whatever we want it to mean? That's what they say. Now, there's many problems with this because the context still doesn't work for them. Let's say, for example, the fall in the way was referring to the rapture. Well, there's a problem. The man of sin must be revealed before that day comes. It's both those things. It's not just the falling away first. The man of sin must also be revealed from the context. And so if we don't know who the Antichrist is, Jesus cannot come back right now. When you just read this and take it at face value in the English, what do you see? You see the fall in the way takes first, where there's a great departing from the faith, and the man of sin, the Antichrist, is revealed first. That is not taking place, so Jesus cannot come back at any moment. That's what we see here in 2 Thessalonians 2. Verse number 4. And let me say this. Pre-Trib crowd believes the Antichrist reveals himself midway through the seven-year period. Now, when you read this verse, it's clear the man of sin must be revealed before that day comes. And they agree the Antichrist comes three and a half years in. And then you're just like, what's the problem then? It's like the man of sin is revealed first midway through. We agree with you in the midst of that seven-year period, and that must take place first before the day comes. So where's the confusion? It's like the Antichrist hasn't revealed himself. He hasn't declared himself to be God yet, okay? So how in the world are you getting to preach your rapture? Well, I mean, obviously, they just want to hold to it. But even if the fall in the way was referring to the departure of the rapture, it wouldn't make sense in this context, because the man of sin must be revealed first. That's what we see before that day comes, before the gathering together underway. Because if you go back to verse 1, it's talking about the coming of the Lord Jesus Christ and the gathering. These are one thing, the coming and the rapture that are taking place. Look at verse number 4. Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called, or that is worshiped, so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. Someone's going to declare himself to be God. This is not the appointed son of God on earth. It's not the Antichrist. He can break your heart. It breaks my heart too, but it's not referring to him. The Bible's going to refer to somebody who's very powerful, very famous, and he's going to declare himself to be God. He's going to show himself to be God. That's not taking place yet. Now, if you go throughout history, a lot of people have claimed to be God that were false. There's many Antichrists revealed in this world. There's a famous one in history that takes place before the New Testament and then after the book of Malachi, Antiochus Epiphanes. And basically, he's kind of like a foreword of the book, but David actually prophesies about that, where basically he slew a pig on the altar, which was an unclean animal, and basically he was forcing all the Jews to basically reject their religion. And it's known as, you know, that was kind of like a type of this event, where he's declaring himself to be God. But here in verse 4, it's referring to the Antichrist that's going to show himself to be God, declare himself to be God in the temple of God. That's not taking place yet. Remember ye not that when I was yet with you, I told you these things? So in verse 5, he's like, don't you remember? I already told you this. I told you these things before. That that man of sin must be revealed first. Today cannot come back. It's not an imminent return. The following way takes place first. Before. That's why the day of Christ is not at hand. It can't be at hand if things must take place first. The Antichrist must be revealed first before Jesus can come back. Now, we'll go to 1 Thessalonians at the end of the sermon. But he's like, I already told you this, Church of Thessalonians. Because 1 Thessalonians talks about the end times, and it talks about the rapture, and it's pretty clear. Verse number 6, And now ye know what withholdeth that ye might be revealed at this time. For the mystery of Nick believed doth already work, only he who now leadeth will lead until he be taken out of the way. And then shall that wicked be revealed whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming. This is the wicked being revealed. Look, the Antichrist will reveal himself to be the Antichrist. He's going to declare himself to be God. He's going to be a false Christ, declaring himself to be God, and look throughout the world. And the Christians are waiting for a pre-tribulate relational rapture return. The Muslims are waiting for their Great One to come. The Hindus are waiting for that great manifestation of God to come. All the religions in the world are waiting for this one person to bring world peace. And it's going to take place. It's going to be Antichrist. He's going to bring world peace and just take people like us. That's what's going to take place. Everyone's looking for world peace. Look, there's going to come someone who's going to bring that world peace. He's going to declare himself to be God. And all the religions, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, you know, most so-called Christians are going to say, Hey, this is the one we've been waiting for. They're going to declare he's the one. The Jews are waiting for it as well. They're waiting for this. It's not Jesus coming back. It's the Antichrist. That's what the Bible talks about. He's going to bring... By peace, he's going to destroy the world, the Bible says. By peace, because he's going to proclaim peace and bring everyone together. He's going to hate people like us. Look, Paul's already told the Church of Thessalonians. That's what it says in verse 5. But that wicked is going to be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming. So the coming of the Lord is going to destroy the Antichrist after he's already revealed. Okay? He's going to destroy the Antichrist after he's revealed, which is three and a half years in. Everybody agrees with that. Look, the Antichrist must be here first. And so his coming mentioned in verse 8 is the same coming mentioned in verse 1. So it's like, yes, you know, I agree. The rapture, he's going to pour out his wrath. It's one event. They're not separate events. You're not seeing separate events here in the Bible. The Antichrist, the Bible says, is going to come to make war with the saints. Look, if all the Christians are raptured from the earth, who's he making war with? It doesn't make any sense. What is he doing? Just persecuting atheists? I mean, that doesn't make any sense. He's going to persecute the LGBT. Is that what's going to take place? That doesn't make any sense. He's coming, the Bible says, to make war with the saints. Look, there's no saints here. Who's he going to make war with? It's not saying he's persecuting the Catholics because it says saints, okay? He's talking to believers there. If there's no saints here, who's he making war with? It does not make any sense. No, the Lord's going to come. When the brightness of his coming, he's going to destroy the Antichrist. He's going to consume the spirit of knowledge which should destroy the brightness of his coming. Verse 9, even him who's coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and light and wonders. So in verse 9, the Antichrist is going to be working in the same manner as Satan. He's going to use the same lying, deceits, the great wonders that people are going to fall for. Throughout the Bible, don't you see everybody wants to see a sign from heaven? The Antichrist will provide that. He's going to come and bring world peace and he's going to show all these great signs and wonders and they're going to say, man, this is God. This is who we've been waiting for to bring all the world together. Verse 10, and with all deceivableness about righteousness and them that perish because they receive not the love of the truth that they might be saved. So he's going to come, the Antichrist is going to destroy the world and then the Lord is going to come and recompense that tribulation the Bible speaks about. Now turn to Matthew 24. What's my point in second Thessalonians 2? Let no man deceive you by any means. Don't let some famous Baptist pastor deceive you. Don't let anybody deceive you because unless the Antichrist is revealed it's not going to take place. I'll tell you what, I don't speak Greek. Show me in English where the falling away means the rapture. That is one of the worst arguments I've ever heard. That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. But it's like people do whatever they want. Just go back to the Greek and say whatever they want to teach. But it says that the falling away and it says the man of sin. Don't we see in today's world a falling away from faith? A falling away from the word God. A falling away from the teachings of God. We see that in our world and it's only going to get worse. People are rejecting the Bible, they're rejecting God and when you reject God you're perfectly waiting for the Antichrist. It's going to fit. It's going to work. They're rejecting God, there's this great falling away and eventually it's going to get so bad the Antichrist is going to come here and bring everybody together. World needs for everyone except people that believe in the Bible and then you get killed just like happened in the Inquisition. So I'm a person from the Catholic Church. Now look at Matthew 24. When you're explaining the rapture if somebody is not open-minded honestly just don't waste your time. It's fine. If somebody wants to just believe the preacher and rapture that's fine. The Bible is very clear on this. If people don't want to know then that's fine. It's not a big deal. But if they're open-minded and you explain 2 Thessalonians 2 and show the Antichrist must come back first they're going to be like, man that makes sense. That is what it says. That makes more sense than the dozen times I've read this chapter and it never made sense. Well then you can take them to Matthew 24 which is obviously a very famous chapter where we get this phrase after the tribulation. Verse number 5, Matthew 24. For many shall come in my name saying I am Christ and shall deceive many. And you shall hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you need not trouble for all these things must come to pass but the end is not yet. For nations shall rise against nations and kingdom against kingdom and there shall be famines and pestilences and earthquakes in diverse places. All these are the beginning of sorrows. So basically it's going to get bad during the end times. But what's mentioned right there that's the beginning of sorrows. I understand we have wars from time to time but they've been wars for thousands of years since human history started. I understand there's people that are hungry people that are low with your family but that's happened for 6,000 years. It's going to get real bad in the end times. These are the beginning of sorrows. Then comes great tribulation as the Bible speaks about. This is during the seven year time period. And this is referred to as the beginning of sorrows. Verse 9, then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted and shall kill you. And you shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. And then shall many be offended and shall betray one another and shall hate one another. And many false prophets shall rise and shall deceive many because iniquity shall abound and the love of many shall wax cold. Now notice in verse number 9 when it talks about they shall kill you what are they killing? Are they killing your body or your spirit? Killing the body. This is physical death. It's not spiritual death. It's physical death. They shall kill you. The context starting at verse 9 is physical death. Verse 13, but he that shall endure on to the end the same shall be saved. Saved from what? What's the context? Physical death. What's it saying? If you endure to the end of the tribulation you will be saved from physical death. Has nothing to do with spiritual salvation. Don't we believe in eternal security? What's saved? Do you have to endure on to the end or just believe on Jesus Christ? You just believe on Jesus Christ. We don't have to endure on to the end and be saved. Look, when you believe on Jesus Christ it's a done deal. You're saved forever no matter what. I give unto them eternal life and they shall never perish. No matter whether you endure on to the end or not we're not Calvinists. If you believe on Jesus Christ you're saved. But what the Bible is saying here is there's the beginning of sorrows before being killed it's going to get bad and if you endure on to the end of the tribulation you're saved from physical death. That's a context. It's not spiritual death. It's physical death. And this phrase, enduring on to the end, appears three times in the Bible all in the reference to the end times. Look, if you believe in salvation by grace through faith I don't know how you line up a preacher or rapture with those verses. Because if you don't understand that that's physical death you're being spared from that then you're saying that you have to endure on to the end and live a good life until the day you die doesn't make sense. God said you're explaining this to someone who's open-minded. Someone who's already saved. And it makes sense to us that you do not have to endure on to the end because it's just believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. And you will be saved if you last through the end of the tribulation you will be raptured at that moment and right after you get raptured God will pour out His wrath on the unbelievers. See the tribulation and the wrath are different. See there's tribulation and that's going to be shortened and then God pours out His wrath on the unbelievers left on earth. Verse 14 Now this abomination of desolation as I mentioned earlier in Tychus Epiphanes was like a type of the abomination of desolation. But then the Antichrist will commit the abomination of desolation. Everybody agrees on this. The preacher, crowd, the matcher, poster, whatever everybody agrees. The abomination of desolation is when the man of sin gets revealed. This is midway through. Everybody agrees on that too. It's three and a half years in. This is three and a half years in. Now look at what it says in verse number 16. Then let them which be in Judea flee into the mountains. Why are you fleeing into the mountains? When the Antichrist reveals himself you know it's going to get bad. Look this is not going to be an accidental event that nobody knows about. Everybody's going to know about this. You're going to find out about the Antichrist just declaring himself to be God. It's going to be bad. And you're going to be persecuted for what you believe. And they will kill you for what you believe. Just like we talked about in the first sermon. Just like during the Inquisition. They will kill you for the things that you believe. Turn to verse 21. So what we've seen is this that the Antichrist is revealed in verse 15 the beginning of the Antichrist is revealed verse 21 for then shall be great tribulation. Then shall be great tribulation. Look the tribulation is going to get great at that time period. Then shall be great tribulation such as not since the beginning of the world to this time no more ever shall be and except those days should be shortened. There should no flesh be saved. But for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. What does that mean that those days are going to be shortened? What it's saying is unless the days of the tribulation are shortened no flesh, no body is going to be saved physically. But if God didn't shorten those days every one of us would be killed. Every single one. Why? Well that's what it says. Except those days should be shortened there should no flesh be saved. But eventually what's going to happen is he's going to shorten those days and he will rapture us before the end of the seven years. So guess what? It's before the wrath of God because God will pour out his wrath on the unbelievable world that's left. But it's after the tribulation you say well how do you know that? Because it mentions in verse 21 the great tribulation. Look the rapture has not taken place yet in this chapter. We're going to see it here. It hasn't taken place yet. And those days must be shortened otherwise no flesh is going to be saved. So God will shorten those days. Verse 29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened and the moon shall not give her light and the stars shall fall from heaven and the powers of the heavens shall be shamed. Let me read that again to you. Immediately after the tribulation Immediately after the tribulation It's not confusing. It's not confusing at all. The man of sin must be revealed first. Well that took place in verse number abomination of desolation was in verse 15 It mentions great tribulation in verse 21 Verse 22 Unless we shorten those days no flesh is going to be saved. Earlier it said those that endure at the end shall be saved. We're talking about physically being saved. Then we see after the tribulation in verse 29 After the tribulation. Not before. Now I did hear one person make this argument. They were trying to defend the preacher rapture and they went back to the Greek and they said this word after in its original context. It's not just referring to like a direct moment like it's taking place but it's the whole event together. So basically it can take place before and still use the word after. I mean it was like a long tentative explanation and I'm just like maybe I'm just a simple person. To me I learned the word after when I was a kid. To me that means after the tribulation is tribulation and afterwards the sun is darkened and the moon shall not give her light and the stars shall fall from heaven and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken. Let me ask you has the sun been darkened? As it's mentioned to you. Now it's not talking about a one time event. I understand there's things that take place. Have you seen this take place when the sun's darkened and the moon doesn't give her light and the stars fall from heaven and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken? Has that taken place yet? No it hasn't. Why hasn't it not taken place? Well first the antichrist must be revealed. That hasn't happened either. Verse 30 Then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn and they shall see the son of man coming to the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. Then you see the sign of the son of man in heaven. Look that's not going to come take place until the powers are shaken the antichrist reveals himself there are things that must take place and when does this take place? After the tribulation it said in verse 29 you say well how do you know this is the rapture? Verse 31 They shall gather together his elect from the four winds from one end of heaven to the other. Gather together his elect. That sounds like the rapture to me. He's gathered together all the people they're going to be brought to heaven this is after the tribulation. Look the sun must be darkened first. These things must take place first. Now if you listen to preacher and people they have all kinds of weird explanations because just reading it the beginning of sorrows the end to be physically saved red tribulation except those days should be shortened no flesh to save then it says after the tribulation and then you see the sign of the son of man in heaven. Now keep in mind how does this chapter start? This chapter starts where his closest followers are asking hey can you tell us about your coming back? That's how the chapter starts. They want to know hey can you tell us about when you come back? And he says hey all these things must take place first. Look there's no evidence that there's multiple comings here. They're asking for the coming your coming tell us about it. And he's like all these things are going to take place first. But you hear a lot of weird explanations and you say how do they get around these? Well look at verse 36 first. Verse 36. They try to negate everything I just preached for the last 15 minutes with one verse. They say but of the day in verse 36 but of the day and hour knoweth no man no not the angels of heaven but my father only. They say well we don't know the day or the hour so that means it can happen right now. Because we don't know the day or the hour. Now look I think it's weird when you have verse after verse after verse saying one thing and then you try to use one verse to negate everything. But what is the context of that day and hour? Look the context is not broken in this chapter. The context goes back to verse 29 when it's immediately after the tribulation. Look I agree that I don't know the day or the hour when he comes back. I'm never going to set a date on the rapture. But even though I don't know the day or the hour there is one thing I do know. It's happening after the tribulation. Look you cannot know the day and the hour but still be aware it happens after the tribulation. And when you look at the context it goes back to the context of verse 29. What's weird is that preacher and people will quote verse 36 and just pretend Matthew 24 doesn't exist. They try to go back to Matthew 24 and say no no no that doesn't apply. This is just written to the Jews. It doesn't apply to us. It's like well why are you quoting Matthew 24? That's the best they got. Now how do we know that this wasn't written to the Jews? We'll turn to Mark 13 and I'll prove it to you. Mark 13. Now one reason we know this was not just written to the Jews is because that he's telling they say well this is just written to his apostles. Well the problem is one of the apostles was Simon the Canaanite. Simon the Canaanite not Simon the Jew. And what does the preacher and crowd say? Well they say well that's just a title. So what if you call me Matthew the American? It's just a title. No. Call me Matthew the Spaniard. It's just a title. Just call me Matthew the Spaniard. Just call me Matthew the German. Wouldn't you assume if you called me Matthew the Spaniard that I was Spanish? Or I at least had strong Hispanic descent? When you call someone you say Matthew the American it makes sense. You say why? Because I'm an American. That's where I'm from. Now look if you call Simon the Canaanite why in the world would you use a title that doesn't make any sense whatsoever? I guess you got to go back to the Greek on that one as well. How do you know it was not just written the Jews are not just written to us 12 Apostles besides the fact that there's Simon the Canaanite as one of those 12. The parallel chapter in the book of Mark is Mark 13. They try to negate this entire chapter and say this is just written to a select group of people. So for a select group of people I'm going to talk to you about the rapture that's for you but not for all the other believers in the world. Well what is the last verse in Mark 13? The last verse I say unto you I say unto all What? He's like what I'm telling you I'm telling everybody. Well the all there doesn't really mean all. It just means some. Now we're cowboys. It's like you can't have your cake and eat it too. It says what I say unto you I say unto all. He's telling everybody. You say why? Because God wants people to be aware about this. He wants us to be aware that the Antichrist is coming first. There's going to be great tribulation it's going to get bad, it's going to get tough and then you're going to see look his disciples ask him they say tell us of thy coming and of the end of the age tell us about it. What does he do? He tells them. Look if I was in that crowd and I was listening to him and that wasn't really referring to his coming it's just like for a special group of people I'd be so confused. Jesus is explaining in Matthew 24 and Mark 13 about his coming and he's saying there's going to be tribulation first and the beginning of sorrows there's going to be signs up in heaven this is taking place before he comes back say well how do you do that? Turn to Revelation 6 So I would suggest starting in 2 Thessalonians 2 and then I'd suggest going to Matthew 24 Now look if they just reject all of that and they say well you know I don't immediately after the tribulation I still think that's before I think that's mistranslated whatever they want to say they're probably not going to change their mind about it. It's fine it is what it is But what you have to understand in Matthew 24 when I talk about the sun being darkened the moon not given light the signs up in heaven this is going to be parallel with the section in Revelation chapter 6 Now I personally would start in 2 Thessalonians 2 but you could choose to start in Revelation 6 before you go to Matthew 24 these are parallel so you're going to go to both places either one of these I think is fine for the second one But Revelation 6 verse 9 Keep in mind the first seal is going to basically be setting off the beginning of the seven year time period And Revelation chapter 6 verse 9 When we had opened the fifth seal I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God for the testimony which they held and they cried with a loud voice saying how long will the Lord holy and true dost thou not judge and abinge our blood on them that dwell on the earth And so what do we see in verse 9 We see martyrs for the cause of Christ in Revelation 6 and 9 And what did it say in verse 10 How long is it going to be Lord until you are abinged our blood on them that dwell on the earth Translation, you have not poured out your wrath yet When are you going to come back and pour out your wrath These are not people that were raptured These are people that were slain killed And how long is it going to be until you come back and pour out your wrath on those that have killed us unjustly Why is it that they were able to kill them unjustly Because the anti-crisis is basically in power And the evil people rule the world at this time And so they are killing and martyring like us Verse number 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them And it was said unto them that they should rest yet for a little season until their fellow servants also of their brethren that should be killed as they were should be fulfilled Now he held them in the sixth seal and lo there was a great earthquake and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair and the moon became his blood Doesn't that sound like what we saw in Matthew 24 The sun becoming black and the moon becoming his blood You say why? Because these are parallel to one another And you can line up Matthew 24 with Revelation 6 and you can see these seals are lining up perfectly What was the context in Matthew 24? After the tribulation Okay So this is in Revelation chapter 6 and we're seeing these signs these cosmic signs Notice what it says in verse 13 And every mountain and island were moved out of their places And the kings of the earth and the great men and the rich men and the chief captains and the mighty men and every bondman and every free man hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains and said to the mountains and rocks fall on us and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne for the wrath of the land for the great day of his wrath is come and who shall be able to stand What is it saying? All these things were prophesied in his great day and his wrath has come to take place All these signs must take place first and once these signs come true all the evil people are like, oh man That's what the Bible spoke about Now they're afraid. They're fleeing to the mountains See, earlier it tells us to flee the mountains And now what happens? Now they're fleeing to the mountains. Why? Because they know the Lord's about to come back The corral is wrathful Now, look at Revelation chapter 7 Actually, look at Revelation 8 verse 1 Revelation 8 verse 1 Now, in Revelation chapter 6 we saw the six seals and this lines up with Matthew 24 because it's not taking place yet And we saw that his great day of his wrath has come So basically his wrath is about to be poured out We're going to skip a chapter for a second I want you to notice the first verse in Revelation 8 Revelation 8 verse 1 And when he had opened the seventh seal there was silence in heaven about the space and half an hour Now, I find it interesting that the six seals went by like this and then all of a sudden a whole chapter goes by before the seventh seal And what happens at the opening of the seventh seal? There's silence in heaven about the space and half an hour. Why is there silence for half an hour? See, from my perspective the seventh seal is pretty significant because this is when rapture that he pours out is wrath It makes sense that this is one of the biggest events in the history of the world There's silence in heaven for a half hour because it's a big event But for the preacher of ground, this is just another seal being opened Why is there silence for this seal? What's so significant about the seventh seal? There's nothing significant about it It's very significant though if you're post-trip If you believe in a pre-rap post-trip rapture because this is the event where there's silence in heaven for half an hour This is the event where there's a rapture and he pours out his wrath But my question is this Why did the whole chapter go by when the moment was about to take place? Why is it that it was about to take place and a whole chapter goes by? Well in this chapter in a moment of time quite a bit of stuff happens Revelation 7 Remember this is after the sixth seal before he pours out his wrath before he raptures and then pours out his wrath Revelation 7 verse 9 After this I beheld and lo a great multitude which no man can number of all nations and kindreds and people and tongues stood before the throne and before the land clothed with white robes and palms in their hands a great multitude which no man can number Look in the Bible they number some pretty big amounts This is an amount no man can number Look this is a lot of people This is the rapture that's taking place All these people are going up in heaven and they come from it says in verse 9 all nations and kindreds and people and tongues from everywhere You say why? There's saved people in every single country in the world Every single country except Vatican City was not a country Every single country there's a saved person There's people saved all over the world who speak every language Why? Because God is the way to get his gospel out to the ends of the world There's a great multitude which no man can number in verse 9 and cried with a loud voice saying salvation you are God who sitteth upon the throne and under the land and all the angels stood round about the throne and about the elders and the poor beasts saying amen blessing and glory and wisdom and thanksgiving and honor and power and might and wonder of God forever and ever Amen Now my question is where did this great multitude come from? Well verse number 12 and one of the elders answered saying on me what are these which are arrayed in white robes and whence came they? So one of the elders up in heaven asked John Hey where did these people come from? Who are these people arrayed in white robes? Where did they come from? Where did they come from? Verse 14 And I said unto him, Sir thou knowest and he said to me these are they which came out of great tribulation and have washed their robes and made them light in the blood of the Lamb A great multitude which no man can number It's the rapture It's very clear Where did they come from? Out of great tribulation Preacher crowd get around this Honestly I've never really heard them give an explanation The best explanation they do is some of them believe in like four raptures, five raptures, six raptures I mean I guess just add as many raptures as you need Try to confuse them It's kind of like an evolutionist that just keeps putting a zero on the end to say however old they want to say it is four and a half billion years old right now I think it is It'll be like ten billion years in a couple years You know it's ridiculous The sign of thy coming One coming, that's the context always These are a great multitude which no man can number This of every nation, every kindred and they came out of great tribulation It's not a local rapture They come from every nation, every kindred every tongue, everywhere They came out of great tribulation God Remember in Revelation 6 When are you going to pour out your judgment God? That's what they're asking, those that have been martyred And then in Revelation 7 we see the rapture And then when you go to Revelation 8 verse 1 That is when he's going to pour out his wrath It's crystal clear in Revelation 6 It's not a confusing concept Now turn to 1 Thessalonians 1 Thessalonians 2 Thessalonians 2 Matthew 24 and Revelation 6 When you show people that Look if they're open minded they are going to confer on it It's very clear It's like how many verses do you need to show It's like when we preach the gospel Look if we explain that salvation is a free gift And you've explained several verses in Romans and John Look you don't have to go to Genesis, and then Exodus and then Leviticus, and then Numbers and then Ephraim, and Joshua Look they're not going to get saved Some people just, they're not going to change their mind It is what it is, that's fine But if you show them those places That's a wealth of information there Now almost everybody When they read the book of Revelation They're going to agree on one thing I'm so confused when I'm reading the book of Revelation Now here's the thing, I'm not confused reading the book of Revelation Right Because it's not complicated Now look I'm not saying I understand all of the symbolism But the timing of the rapture It's not complicated Right And quite honestly so many people are confused And the reason why they're confused is because They're hearing a preacher of rapture being taught And it never makes sense I mean it's got more holes in it than a slice of Swiss cheese There's so many problems with the preacher of rapture They're bouncing all around, they say Well you know, hear the word coming means this Go back to the Greek here Four raptures, that's what Peter read at the top There's like four raptures in the book of Revelation Like what in the world? It's like the Bible's meant to be simple It's meant to be easy to understand It's not complicated, now remember in 2 Thessalonians 2 What he told the church of Thessalonica Is that remember When I was with you I told you these things So let's go back to 1 Thessalonians And let's see everything That he taught them in 1 Thessalonians Now quite honestly the chapters we looked at That should be enough in Birmingham That was enough for my wife when I showed her that I can't remember if I showed her other places I explained stuff, other things to her But you know in Matthew 24, 2 Thessalonians 2 And then Revelation 6 up to chapter 8 verse 1 That should be enough for people that are with mine Let's see what it says in 1 Thessalonians 1 Verse 6 What did he teach the church of Thessalonica? Verse 6 So the church of Thessalonica They had afflictions They had persecutions They had tribulation That's what we see in chapter 1 Turn to chapter 3 And it says in chapter 3 verse 1 Why do they need comfort? Because they're going through persecution Now this is not the end times tribulation But what you see throughout the Bible Is God's people always go through tribulation They always go through persecution Throughout the Bible Every single book of the Bible God's people go through persecution They go through trials So to suggest that during the end times There's a select group of Christians That don't suffer any persecution It doesn't really make a whole lot of sense Because for over 6,000 years they're always going through persecution Now chapter 3 verse 1 It says Wherefore we can no longer prevail We've got it good to be left at Athens alone And this is comfort you concerning your faith Verse 3 That no man should be moved by these afflictions For yourselves know that we are appointed thereon too We're appointed to afflictions and persecutions and trials Verse 4 For verily when we are with you We told you before that we should suffer tribulation Even as it came to pass And we know God's people always go through tribulation Right This is where the preacher gets confused The tribulation and the wrath of God are not the same thing The tribulation is when believers go through persecutions The wrath of God is when God pours out his wrath on believers Don't we use John 3 to 36 often in our soloing presentation? Those that do not get saved He that believeth not the Son should not see light But the wrath of God abideth on them Forever God's wrath abides on those people in hell Because when people do not believe on Jesus Christ He is angry at the wicked every day And his wrath will always abide on them It's not God's people Look up in heaven God's wrath doesn't abide on them That's to those that don't believe on the Son Because God doesn't pour out his wrath on his people That has nothing to do with political tribulation I've explained this to them I've talked to pastors about this before And they told me things like this I just don't believe that God will set fire to building with his people inside of us And it's like that's not what's taking place This is not God causing us to go through tribulation Like he's persecuting us Like he's hunting us down That's not what's taking place It's the antichrist It's the devil It's wicked people That's always throughout the Bible God's people go through tribulation They go through persecutions Afflictions Look at chapter 4 Now it makes sense That he explains the rapture To the church of Thessalonica Because of the fact it's really the church that you notice That's going through persecutions And so it makes perfect sense to that church That hey we're going through a lot of trials And then he's explaining during the end times Guess what? I'm going through a lot of tribulation And then I'm going to rapture my people Chapter 4 verse 13 But I will not have you to be ignorant Rather concerning them which are asleep That you sorrow not even as others which have no hope For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again Even so them also which sleep in Jesus Will God bring with him For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord That we which are alive and remain under the company of the Lord Shall not prevent them which are asleep So he's saying you know those that are alive and remain Kind of reminds me of he that endureth We shall be saved Except those days should be shortened there should no flesh be saved We which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord Shall not prevent them which are asleep Once again the coming of the Lord It applies as one coming Not all coming It doesn't prevent those that are asleep Why? Because when those that are dead When you come back you're going to rapture them as well You're going to come up to heaven along with us Verse 16 he clarifies this For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout Because we are a danger with the trump of God And the dead in Christ shall rise first Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them In the clouds and meet the Lord in the air And so shall we ever be with the Lord Wherefore comfort one another with these works Now verse 18 it says comfort one another Look the comfort is not that you will have no tribulation I think we're already going through tribulation Okay it's like well why don't you take away that tribulation And then they're coming They're going through tribulation The comfort is that those that are asleep Are lost loved ones that have died When they go to be with the Lord They're going to come with us That's the comfort The comfort is not hey there's no persecution No the comfort is not everybody knows that I've already passed away As well Now once you understand that this is known to be the rapture passage And I agree with that It doesn't explain the timing of rapture It doesn't explain preacher It doesn't explain posture as well It does say alive and remain in the coming of the Lord But you know it doesn't really give you the timing But I want you to understand the context is not broken Go to 1 Thessalonians 5 verse 1 and let's continue See the chapters were added They're helpful, they're good But often times when you come to the end of a chapter You need to keep reading to understand what's going on Right The context isn't broken 1 Thessalonians 5 verse 1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh As it be in the night Now there's a famous movie called the chief of the night It actually was it a couple of days ago And I can say this is one of the worst movies I've ever seen in my life I always thought it was a really low budget But it's just like everybody's just raptured out of the world And everyone's like where is everybody Oh no And it's just like everybody gets raptured And then people are left behind They're crying, they're weeping It's like man I mocked this pre-tribulation rapture It came to pass, it's true By the way the person who did that movie When you watch it, there's pretty much more salvation in that movie as well But you know it's a really low budget But he's kind of like left behind But even more low budget than that But what they say is the movie's called a thief in the night Basically what they say is That it can come back at any moment Thief in the night, okay Well I want you to understand that God clarifies What it means by thief in the night Notice verse 3 For when they shall say peace and safety Then sudden destruction cometh upon them As travail upon a woman's child And they shall not escape When it says a thief in the night It's not that it comes unexpectedly It comes quickly It happens really quickly That's what's taking place Because when a thief robs you at night They don't stop eating a ham sandwich I'm going to stop and cook something in the microwave Just spend some time in here You know what I'm saying They just quickly rob you and get out Because otherwise you'll catch them They come as a thief in the night What do they do? They quickly come in They come out And what does it say in verse 4? This proves that it cannot just come unawares to us Because in verse 4 But ye brethren are not in darkness That they should overtake you as a thief Look we're not in darkness We're aware of these things It can't just come at any moment Unexpectedly we didn't see it coming No we're not in darkness That they should overtake us as a thief Why? Because he explained very thoroughly Things that must take place first But it can't just come as a thief in the night right now I say why? We're not in darkness where it can just come Yes we don't know the day or the hour But what we do know is the man of sin is revealed first And once that takes place All of a sudden it's making us aware of these things Ok we're getting closer And then people start reading the book of Revelation The book of Daniel probably a lot more Get a better understanding of these things And you're seeing things come to pass Bob will be very specific about these things There are complicated things in Daniel with Revelation The timing of the rapture is not one of those things But there are complicated things And I'm sure as we get closer to the end times There's verses that are going to make more sense to us Than to do now I'm sure when John was writing this He was probably confused about a lot of us But as we get closer We can see these things coming to pass Now notice what it says in verse 9 1 Thessalonians 5 verse 9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath But to obtain us from the dead Not appointed us to wrath But to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ One of the big preachers arguments Is that we're saying You go through the wrath of God That is not what we're saying Now look when it comes to being post-tribulation There are other people that are post-tribulation Post-wrath We are not like that Generally the Calvinists believe in a post-tribulation Post-wrath rapture At least in America Here they like to be everything So I don't know what they teach But we don't believe that because it says We're not appointed unto wrath in verse 9 We're not saying that God's people are going to be persecuted by God We're saying we're persecuted by the antichrists And the devil and the forces in place But notice how it says we're not appointed to wrath But I want you to go back To verse 3 of 1 Thessalonians 1 Thessalonians 3 verse 3 1 Thessalonians chapter 3 verse 3 We are not appointed to wrath Let me show you something we are appointed to 1 Thessalonians chapter 3 verse 3 That no man should be moved by these afflictions For yourself to know that we are appointed thereon to We are not appointed to wrath We're appointed to affliction Persecution And trials and tribulations Just as every prophet in the Old Testament Went through persecutions Just as the great men of God Historically speaking Assuming it is true Most of them were martyred to death I don't know that But if tradition serves us correct And I would believe that Because of the persecution from the Catholic Church Before that with the Roman Empire It makes sense to me Look we are appointed to tribulation And affliction We're not appointed to wrath Because that's God pouring out his wrath But we do go through tribulation and trials and inflations Now turn to 2 Thessalonians And let's look at 2 Thessalonians one last place Chapter 1 verses 4 through 10 2 Thessalonians 1 verse 4 So that we ourselves glory in you In the churches of God through your patience and faith In all your persecutions and tribulations That ye endure Now remember in 1 Thessalonians He talks to them about the rapture And how you're appointed to affliction Then he talks about persecutions and tribulations Verse 5 Which is the manifest token of the righteous judgment of God That he may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God For which he also suffered Seeing it as a righteous thing with God To recompense tribulation to them that trouble you God is going to recompense tribulation God's pattern Is he allows his people to go through tribulation And then he comes and he evens the score Then he pours out the wrath on those wicked people But he allows us to go through tribulation first All of us All that will live godly in Christ Jesus Shall suffer persecution Except during the end times All the millions of the rapture None of them will live for any persecution Because during the end times you get no persecution whatsoever No God's people will live for persecution That's what says we're appointed there understood Verse 6 He says he's going to recompense tribulation To those that trouble us Verse 7 And to you who are troubled rest with us We get to rest When the Lord Jesus is revealed When he comes back And every eye shall see him Even though people say nobody's going to know Though every eye shall see him Verse 8 Inflaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God And that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction From the presence of the Lord And from the glory of his power When he shall come to be glorified in the saints And to be admired in all that we believe Because our testimony among you was believed in that day He will come back Be glorified in his saints And he will recompense tribulation First the tribulation Takes place Now look this sermon is not This is kind of the same information A lot of you already know But this sermon was meant to show you how you can teach something This is what I've done I've chosen 2 Thessalonians 2 2 Thessalonians 2 Matthew 24 Thessalonians 6 up to 8 verse 1 Those are like your heavy weight scriptures to show Now during the conversation This is what's going to take place If they're open minded They'll start to ask you questions Because they're going to assume the tribulation and the wrath Are both seven years They think they're the same thing They don't understand the tribulation gets short They think the whole time is God's wrath They think that what we're saying is that we're going through God's wrath That's not what we're saying They are confused by a lot of different things And so some people don't believe A post-tribulation rapture Not because it's that complicated But just because they were never taught And they're confused They've heard a lot of false things And so when you're talking to them They're going to start asking you some questions Now here's the key though You need to be able to answer those questions You don't want to be able to say Here's a sermon to listen to Here's a documentary you can watch You need to be able to actually teach them And everything that I teach at this church You need to not just believe things You need to know how to teach things You need to know where to turn Not just that if somebody tries To confuse you That you're going to still stick to what you believe No, you need to be able to actually Teach people And that's when you show that you really understand it very well I don't want people to just be Zombies, just brother stuffies and this That's really true No, you need to know what you believe And look, if you disagree with me, that's fine Read those chapters, read Matthew 24 2 Thessalonians 2 Revelation 6, 7, and 8 And whatever conclusion you come to That's fine, you need to know for yourselves You say, I believe this very strongly You need to know how to teach it And if you don't know how to teach it And a lot of this stuff is new information to you You need to actually sit down and read those chapters And understand how you're going to show somebody So let's give the Word prayer Dear Heavenly Father, thank you for allowing us to be here today And just your Word That was always precious and great to us, God You know, it's something that we've experienced